Difference between revisions of "Pyramid honing guide"

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m (Using the Norton 4k - using the Norton Pyramids to dial in an edge)
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What is the pyramid method of honing? The theory behind the pyramid system is simple: You alternate between hones of two different grits, using a lot of strokes on the coarser side to start out, then using fewer and fewer as you continue. Usually, the pyramid is done on a Norton 4000/8000 grit combination stone, which was popularized by Lynn Abrams, SRP's founder.  It is called a "pyramid" because the strokes on the coarse side of the stone taper off as you go: You might start with 10, for example, then 5, then 3, then 1.<ref>http://www.straightrazorplace.com/forums/basic-honing/23863-pyramid-honing-photo-tutorial.html#post232661</ref>
 
What is the pyramid method of honing? The theory behind the pyramid system is simple: You alternate between hones of two different grits, using a lot of strokes on the coarser side to start out, then using fewer and fewer as you continue. Usually, the pyramid is done on a Norton 4000/8000 grit combination stone, which was popularized by Lynn Abrams, SRP's founder.  It is called a "pyramid" because the strokes on the coarse side of the stone taper off as you go: You might start with 10, for example, then 5, then 3, then 1.<ref>http://www.straightrazorplace.com/forums/basic-honing/23863-pyramid-honing-photo-tutorial.html#post232661</ref>
  
The pyramid is a popular approach because it is simple and it works. As you progress in your honing abilities, you will develop theories as to why it works, but even some of the more advanced honers seem to disagree on the theory behind it. For right now, let is just say that it helps you avoid some of the vexing problems of honing and creates a clear path for you to follow. It helps you avoid the dreaded "overhoned edge," and it partially answers the question "how many strokes do I do?"<ref>http://www.straightrazorplace.com/forums/basic-honing/23863-pyramid-honing-photo-tutorial.html#post232661</ref>
+
The pyramid is a popular approach because it is simple and it works. As you progress in your honing abilities, you will develop theories as to why it works, but even some of the more advanced honers seem to disagree on the theory behind it. For right now, let is just say that it helps you avoid some of the vexing problems of honing and creates a clear path for you to follow. It helps you avoid the dreaded "overhoned edge," and it partially answers the question "how many strokes do I do?"<ref>http://straightrazorplace.com/forums/basic-honing/39805-pyramid-honing.html</ref>
  
 
== Pyramid Honing: a howto guide==
 
== Pyramid Honing: a howto guide==
  
The purpose of the 1000 grit is to remove nicks and straighten/shape an edge. For that you use your eyes and the [[Sharpness_tests_explained#TNT_-_Thumb_Nail_Test | Thumb Nail Test (TNT)]], not the [[Sharpness_tests_explained#TPT_-_Thumb_Pad_Test | Thumb Pad Test]]. The edge should be free of nicks and the bevel should go all the way to the edge. If you are using a hand held microscope then the bevel will appear as one color, if there are two bevels, old and new, then the light reflects off the bevel at different angles and appears as two colors. The scratch pattern should also be uniform for both the length and width of the bevel. When you have that then move on to the 4000, but not before.
+
The following guide was written by [http://www.straightrazorplace.com/forums/members/lynn.html Lynn Abrams]<ref>http://straightrazorplace.com/forums/basic-honing/39805-pyramid-honing.html</ref>
  
=== Using the Norton 1k - getting rid of nicks and establishing the bevel ===
+
The main thing to remember is that it really helps to make sure you have a proper bevel on your razor before going to the pyramids. Do you have to? Not every time depending on the razor, but generally, it's really the best thing to do to help you get to that edge that will shave nicely.
  
: ''Main article: [[Bevel-setting in theory and practice]].''
+
Another thing about the pyramids is that they are basically guidelines and people have used them as they are with success as well as experimented and used similar methods with varying stroke counts that have worked for them.
  
The Norton 1000 is a slow cutter compared to a 1000 grit wet/dry sandpaper or a 1200 grit diamond hone. Use what ever number of strokes it requires to get rid of the nicks and establishing a bevel. This is the most time consuming portion of honing a razor, be patient and persistent.
+
Are pyramids a scientifically sound process based on laboratory testing along with basic honing, granular structure and metallurgy principles? Absolutely! I have conducted extreme analysis on pyramids and written at least 5 journals and 3 thesis papers on the subject. Pyramids are beyond any question an incremental process of improving a razors edge to shavability. Unfortunately, there was this fire and all my data was destroyed or I would be attaching it here for your scrutiny. Dang, I hate when that happens!
  
=== Using the Norton 4k - using the Norton Pyramids to dial in an edge ===
+
So, when I think pyramids and by the way, I didn't invent this process; it was taught to me by the first honemeister Don Walters. Oh yeah, pyramids. Here are the pyramids that I use for carbon razors:
  
Once you get to the 4000 grit then you stop using the [[Sharpness_tests_explained#TNT_-_Thumb_Nail_Test | Thumb Nail Test (TNT)]] and rely upon the [[Sharpness_tests_explained#TPT_-_Thumb_Pad_Test | Thumb Pad Test]] and [[Sharpness_tests_explained#HHT_-_Hanging_Hair_Test | Hanging Hair Test (HHT)]]. You should be using both the [[Sharpness_tests_explained#TNT_-_Thumb_Nail_Test |TNT]] and the [[Sharpness_tests_explained#TPT_-_Thumb_Pad_Test | TPT]] while you are using the 1000 grit so that you develop a "feel" for what is happening to the edge.
+
25 Strokes on 4K 25 Strokes on 8K
 +
20 Strokes on 4K 20 Strokes on 8K
 +
15 Strokes on 4K 15 Strokes on 8K
 +
10 Strokes on 4K 10 strokes on 8K
 +
5 Strokes on 4K 5 Strokes on 8K
 +
3 Strokes on 4K 3 Strokes on 8K
 +
1 Stroke on 4K 3 Strokes on 8K
 +
1 Stroke on 4K 5 Strokes on 8K
  
When you start using the 4000 grit then use an [[Norton_Pyramid_Honing_Guide#Aggressive_Honing_Ratio |aggressive pyramid]] first, testing with the [[Sharpness_tests_explained#TPT_-_Thumb_Pad_Test | TPT]] frequently, and when it seems that you are getting close based on the [[Sharpness_tests_explained#TPT_-_Thumb_Pad_Test | TPT]], [[Sharpness_tests_explained#HHT_-_Hanging_Hair_Test |HHT]] and the arm hair test then drop down to a [[Norton_Pyramid_Honing_Guide#Conservative_Honing_Ratio | conservative pyramid]], again, testing frequently. Then perform 50 roundtrip laps on a plain leather hanging strop and test shave. Do the best beard prep possible. Do not be surprised if the razor is not quite perfect. Just go back and perform a conservative pyramid then strop and test shave again. It is not unusual to take 2-3-4 honing sessions to dial in an edge.
+
That is pretty much it. It is important to use basically just the pressure of the blade on the stone. I use an X stroke and try to make sure that I keep the blade very flat through out the stroke and make sure I keep the pressure even though out the stroke. Spine and edge of the razor on the stone with even pressure at all times. This does take a little practice, but usually can be picked up pretty easily.
  
=== Conservative Honing Ratio ===
+
I can use a 45 degree angle X stroke for blades with badly flattened or uneven spines, wedges and smiley or frowning blades and it seems to work very well as it helps keep the edge on the stone throughout the stroke.
  
This is a suggestion for a straight razor that is almost keen. It shaves but it pulls at the whiskers. I use the thumb test to see when the edge has attained a noticeable change in feel. Then strop for 35 laps on plain leather and test shave. Repeat as necessary. Please note that this ''only'' applies to the use of a Norton waterstone. It does ''not'' apply to Japanese waterstones, a [[Belgian_Hones|Belgian stone]], Arkansas stones, classic barber hones, [[:Category:Pasted_Strops|pasted strops]] or sandpaper. Use the [[Sharpness_tests_explained#TPT_-_Thumb_Pad_Test | thumb pad test]] at any point during this sequence and stop if you feel the edge is now keen.
+
No I don't start every razor at the top with 25 strokes. Normally I will work from 15 strokes down and sometimes try working from 10 strokes down on new razors. If you have a razor that seems like the bevel is OK, you can start at the 25 strokes, but usually if you think you need more, you should go ahead and go down to a 1K and set a new bevel.
  
{| class="wikitable" style="margin: 1em auto 1em auto"
+
''Less strokes are better!''
|-
 
! Set #
 
! Norton 4000
 
! Norton 8000
 
|-
 
| 1
 
| 1
 
| 5
 
|-
 
| 2
 
| 1
 
| 5
 
|-
 
| 3
 
| 3
 
| 5
 
|-
 
| 4
 
| 5
 
| 5
 
|-
 
| 5
 
| 3
 
| 5
 
|-
 
| 6
 
| 3
 
| 5
 
|-
 
| 7
 
| 1
 
| 5
 
|-
 
| 8
 
| 1
 
| 5
 
|-
 
| 9
 
| 1
 
| 5
 
|}
 
  
=== Aggressive Honing Ratio ===
+
I have really enjoyed working with the Naniwa Super Stones lately and they offer some fun when using the pyramids. You can use either the 3K or the 5K in rotation with the 8K and they work very well with consistent and good results. I have been using the 3K for more the eBay type razors or those in a little rougher shape and using the 5K with nicer razors and full or extra hollow grinds..
  
Use this sequence when the razor is not shaving at all.
+
This process also works very well with the Shapton Glass 4K and 8K stones.
  
{| class="wikitable" style="margin: 1em auto 1em auto"
+
When I first learned this process, I learned it on a Norton Combo 4K/8K stone and have worn out the 4K side on 8 stones since that time. When I first started, I was shaving right off the 8K side and had fantastic results. This was before I discovered the natural finishing stones and then the pasting or spray media. On the new Nortons, I recommend lapping off about 1/8 of an inch of the 4K side to get past the grainy feeling the newer stones have. Once the 4K side starts to feel smooth to the touch, you are there.
|-
 
! Set #
 
! Norton 4000
 
! Norton 8000
 
|-
 
| 1
 
| 15
 
| 5
 
|-
 
| 2
 
| 10
 
| 5
 
|-
 
| 3
 
| 5
 
| 5
 
|-
 
| 4
 
| 3
 
| 5
 
|-
 
| 5
 
| 1
 
| 5
 
|-
 
| 6
 
| 1  
 
| 5
 
|}
 
  
Be sure and use some sort of test before starting so you can evaluate the rate of change that is occurring. I use the [[Sharpness_tests_explained#TPT_-_Thumb_Pad_Test | thumb pad test]] and the [[Sharpness_tests_explained#HHT_-_Hanging_Hair_Test | hanging hair test]]. Repeat the honing sequence as necessary and move to the conservative sequence when you think you are getting close. The goal is to avoid over-honing which can make the edge act like a piece of aluminium foil because it is to thin and weak.
+
When we talk about lapping the stones, I really lap more to make sure I get the swarf off the stones and clean them up for the next use more than I am concerned with a millionth degree of flatness. Mostly flat is usually all you need to hone your razor so long as the edge and spine remain on the stone throughout your stroke. OK purists, don't get upset, as flat as you can get the stone is not a bad thing either. I have seen many a dished out or bowed hone from the old days and people were using them and shaving. I was using a pumice stone before Norton came out with the flattening stone and needles to say my stones were not perfectly flat, but I honed thousands of razor that were great shavers without difficulty.
 +
 
 +
The only real variation to the pyramid that I do is toward the end of the process on stainless razors or the newer harder feeling type steel razors.
 +
The variation starts at the 3 stroke level.
 +
 
 +
3 Strokes on 4K 5 Strokes on 8K
 +
1 Stroke on 4K 5 Strokes on 8K
 +
1 Stroke on 4K 7 Strokes on 8K
 +
 
 +
I find that these razors do better with more polishing strokes.
 +
 
 +
The pretty much sums up the pyramid method that I use. With a little practice, this is a very consistent and repeatable process and once learned can really lay the foundation for experimenting with various other honing techniques.
  
 
== Pyramid Honing: A Photo Tutorial==
 
== Pyramid Honing: A Photo Tutorial==

Revision as of 21:36, 8 August 2009

What is the pyramid method of honing? The theory behind the pyramid system is simple: You alternate between hones of two different grits, using a lot of strokes on the coarser side to start out, then using fewer and fewer as you continue. Usually, the pyramid is done on a Norton 4000/8000 grit combination stone, which was popularized by Lynn Abrams, SRP's founder. It is called a "pyramid" because the strokes on the coarse side of the stone taper off as you go: You might start with 10, for example, then 5, then 3, then 1.[1]

The pyramid is a popular approach because it is simple and it works. As you progress in your honing abilities, you will develop theories as to why it works, but even some of the more advanced honers seem to disagree on the theory behind it. For right now, let is just say that it helps you avoid some of the vexing problems of honing and creates a clear path for you to follow. It helps you avoid the dreaded "overhoned edge," and it partially answers the question "how many strokes do I do?"[2]

Pyramid Honing: a howto guide

The following guide was written by Lynn Abrams[3]

The main thing to remember is that it really helps to make sure you have a proper bevel on your razor before going to the pyramids. Do you have to? Not every time depending on the razor, but generally, it's really the best thing to do to help you get to that edge that will shave nicely.

Another thing about the pyramids is that they are basically guidelines and people have used them as they are with success as well as experimented and used similar methods with varying stroke counts that have worked for them.

Are pyramids a scientifically sound process based on laboratory testing along with basic honing, granular structure and metallurgy principles? Absolutely! I have conducted extreme analysis on pyramids and written at least 5 journals and 3 thesis papers on the subject. Pyramids are beyond any question an incremental process of improving a razors edge to shavability. Unfortunately, there was this fire and all my data was destroyed or I would be attaching it here for your scrutiny. Dang, I hate when that happens!

So, when I think pyramids and by the way, I didn't invent this process; it was taught to me by the first honemeister Don Walters. Oh yeah, pyramids. Here are the pyramids that I use for carbon razors:

25 Strokes on 4K 25 Strokes on 8K 20 Strokes on 4K 20 Strokes on 8K 15 Strokes on 4K 15 Strokes on 8K 10 Strokes on 4K 10 strokes on 8K 5 Strokes on 4K 5 Strokes on 8K 3 Strokes on 4K 3 Strokes on 8K 1 Stroke on 4K 3 Strokes on 8K 1 Stroke on 4K 5 Strokes on 8K

That is pretty much it. It is important to use basically just the pressure of the blade on the stone. I use an X stroke and try to make sure that I keep the blade very flat through out the stroke and make sure I keep the pressure even though out the stroke. Spine and edge of the razor on the stone with even pressure at all times. This does take a little practice, but usually can be picked up pretty easily.

I can use a 45 degree angle X stroke for blades with badly flattened or uneven spines, wedges and smiley or frowning blades and it seems to work very well as it helps keep the edge on the stone throughout the stroke.

No I don't start every razor at the top with 25 strokes. Normally I will work from 15 strokes down and sometimes try working from 10 strokes down on new razors. If you have a razor that seems like the bevel is OK, you can start at the 25 strokes, but usually if you think you need more, you should go ahead and go down to a 1K and set a new bevel.

Less strokes are better!

I have really enjoyed working with the Naniwa Super Stones lately and they offer some fun when using the pyramids. You can use either the 3K or the 5K in rotation with the 8K and they work very well with consistent and good results. I have been using the 3K for more the eBay type razors or those in a little rougher shape and using the 5K with nicer razors and full or extra hollow grinds..

This process also works very well with the Shapton Glass 4K and 8K stones.

When I first learned this process, I learned it on a Norton Combo 4K/8K stone and have worn out the 4K side on 8 stones since that time. When I first started, I was shaving right off the 8K side and had fantastic results. This was before I discovered the natural finishing stones and then the pasting or spray media. On the new Nortons, I recommend lapping off about 1/8 of an inch of the 4K side to get past the grainy feeling the newer stones have. Once the 4K side starts to feel smooth to the touch, you are there.

When we talk about lapping the stones, I really lap more to make sure I get the swarf off the stones and clean them up for the next use more than I am concerned with a millionth degree of flatness. Mostly flat is usually all you need to hone your razor so long as the edge and spine remain on the stone throughout your stroke. OK purists, don't get upset, as flat as you can get the stone is not a bad thing either. I have seen many a dished out or bowed hone from the old days and people were using them and shaving. I was using a pumice stone before Norton came out with the flattening stone and needles to say my stones were not perfectly flat, but I honed thousands of razor that were great shavers without difficulty.

The only real variation to the pyramid that I do is toward the end of the process on stainless razors or the newer harder feeling type steel razors. The variation starts at the 3 stroke level.

3 Strokes on 4K 5 Strokes on 8K 1 Stroke on 4K 5 Strokes on 8K 1 Stroke on 4K 7 Strokes on 8K

I find that these razors do better with more polishing strokes.

The pretty much sums up the pyramid method that I use. With a little practice, this is a very consistent and repeatable process and once learned can really lay the foundation for experimenting with various other honing techniques.

Pyramid Honing: A Photo Tutorial

The following guide was written by JoshEarl[4]

See also

Acknowledgements

  • Credit for making known the honing pyramid technique goes to Lynn Abrams, the founder of the Yahoo Straightrazorplace forum and the http://www.straightrazorplace.com website. To Lynn and all the other razor gurus "THANKS !"
  • The pyramid honing instructions were sent in a PM to JimmyHAD by randydance062449 who is always a great help to new members and veteran forum members alike.
  • The photo tutorial was originally written by JoshEarl[5]

References